The guilds kept a heavy thumb on the pyramid of craftsmen in that there were few master mechanics & many, many more apprentices, journeymen & skilled mechanics. Having a bias that the name atop the tubes of a sporting weapon is not the actual maker is generally a good stance, but it is possible with bespoken sporting weapons makers like the smaller ones in Ferlach that they played some part in the overall construction of the sporting weapons bearing their name. The larger concerns would source components and efforts from other gunmaking centers like Liege & Suhl/Zella Sankt Blasii - Mehlis in order to fill orders. I am not certain if Josef Winkler was a member of the Consortium or not but I am confident that he at a minimum sourced components and possibly some effort from the Consortium.
A guess was that he had say 3 mechanics and possibly double that number of apprentices & journeyman and rolled out quality examples. Ferlach craftsmen are some of the best tube tuners around & their proximity to the local forest/shooting grounds provides an excellent opportunity to equip upper rung hunters with their whims.With all that said, if I could view a quality image of the water table/action flats & the flats from the breech to the forend hanger, I could hazard a guess.Kind Regards,RaimeyrseLast edited by on Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total. Another tid-bit of info as that examples suggest that Jakob Koshat acquired the shop of Josef Winkler:J. Koschat-Winklers Nachf. Stamp seen on examples-Jakob Koschat - Josef Winkler's Nachfolger or Jakob Koschat successor to Josef Winkler or vice versa.
I would hazard a guess that Jakob Koschat married Josef Winkler's daughter or grand-daughter or vice versa. If so, it is highly probable that Jakob Koschat was either an apprentice or journeyman at Josef Winkler's shop. So you can search out Jakob Koschat's examples to see the quality that is typically ferried forward by the heirs and assigns of a craftsman.
Ferlach (in Slovene: Borovlje) is the southernmost town in Austria, about 17 km south of the Carinthian capital Klagenfurt. It is situated in the Rosental Valley of the Drava River, at the base of the northern slope of the Karawanken mountain range.
Then again there is Benedikt Winkler? I'll have to dig a bit.Kind Regards,Raimeyrse. Digging deeper in the sand pile of Ferlach gunmaking as the sand piles in on you, it appears highly probable that 2 gunmaking brothers Schaschl departed Liege to establish a dynasty of gunmaking in Ferlach in the late 1500s.
![Josef juch ferlach paul Josef juch ferlach paul](http://www.germanhuntingguns.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/83.-Winkler.jpg)
Their families may have originated in Maastricht, Holland or mechanics from Maastricht, Holland were recruited. Premier Ferlach tube maker John Schaschl gives origins as far back as circa 1650 and has to be one of the descendants of the Brothers Schaschl, who would have provided a workshop for subsequent Ferlach mechanics to study and pass thru. Seems there is quite a story here also.Kind Regards,Raimeyrse.
CBL1Can you describe in more detail the markings on the barrels right by the flats in your gun? EJSXSThanks to all for the fascinating information - very helpful. I will seek to take some better pictures in the next week or so and post up. Expanding the pictures doesn't provide a lot more clarity so back to the camera work. Will also try and get some choke/bore measurements on the barrels and try to use the gun before the end of the UK season on Feb 1st!#176937 - 01/31/10 07:07 PM Re: Josef Mischitz - Ferlach?BoxlockRegistered: 01/31/10Posts: 2Loc: Charlotte NC. The intertwined 'EF' on the individual tubes is the preliminary mark for Ferlach.
The 'NP' sub 'F' is the nitro proof at Ferlach and possibly final proofmark by later rules? The 2 headed eagle was either the mark of a final examination or a 3rd proof if required and should have a '1' on the breastplate. '216.68' would be the 216th example thru the Ferlach proofhouse in 1968. I would guess the '15087' to be the serial number. '12/70' is the bore & chamber length.
And Boehler Blitz is of course the steel type and I think it was a rung below Antit.Kind Regards,Raimeyrse#177146 - 02/02/10 07:45 PM Re: Josef Mischitz - Ferlach?BoxlockRegistered: 01/31/10Posts: 2Loc: Charlotte NC. CBL1:Fortunately for gun enthusiasts like you and me, older used Ferlach guns can still be found for reasonable prices.Here in central Europe an avarage used Ferlach double can be found for around one thousand euros, but an extra nice specimen like yours should easyly bring twice this amount; IMHO of course.
With kind regards, JaniJani - I hope your honest opinion is accurate therefore as I am placing the gun for sale with Bonhams this coming Dec sale! Will be interesting to see if there is any interest in this market as these guns tend to be quite a specialised area of the auction market in the UK.(Moderators - please remove this if it is against forum rules as I am not trying to drum up a sale.).
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